After my long relationship (7+), i started dating again. Unfortunately i discovered that no one is looking for a meaningful connection or a serious conversation. Everyone wants to catered and be heard, no one wants to listen for just a second. I actively stopped myself from flirting/dating anymore, it’s just a complete waste of time 🤷♂️im sorry to say many many many girls are VERY VERY superficial people.
reading this thread I’m glad I’m a removed in a relationship. my spouse is the best. i got so fucking lucky.
there’s a massive epidemic of loneliness out there. the loss of the free/cheap third spaces, lockdowns, and social media have made a fucking shitstorm. I’m scared for the generations below me just starting to enter the workforce. so many kids just unable to function properly.
i can’t solve it. but I’ve been putting my devices down more and (trying) to get out more. get more sunlight and fresh air, even if i just sit outside and watch the ducks. it’s hard out there. give yourself a break, okay? eat a snack and take a walk.
I’m 41 now but I haven’t gone on a date-date in 3 years or so. The TL;DR online dating is absolutely not worth participating in. Neither is speed dating, and people are isolating more and more.
I’m not wildly attractive but I’m not unattractive either. I’m probably like a 6 or a 7. I think I’m interesting and can hold a reasonable conversation. I’m intelligent. I’ve been told I’m funny (sometimes). I am a bit clumsy sometimes though. I’ve been in two long term (3+ years) relationships in my life but one of those relationships ended due to alcohol (we mutually sucked at the time), and the other due to financial reasons. Both hurt pretty deep when they ended and I didn’t date for a couple years after either of those.
In the time that I wasn’t feeling some form of loss from relationships that meant something, I tried online dating. I tried OkCupid, Bumble, PlentyOfFish, some bullshit regarding a bagel, Tinder, match.com, etc. I probably tried any of them that were active at the time. Not once did it ever amount to a relationship, in probably 15 years of using those sites off and on. I’ve unquestionably had more bad experiences than good. 9 out of 10 dates are bad. 1 ouf of 10 are ok. The worst time I recall was when a woman drugged me after our date. Another bad time I can recall, my date showed up on drugs or drunk or just incredibly stupid or something. She racked up a $110 bar tab during our 30 minute meet and greet and dipped out without saying anything at all or paying the bill. I was once catfished (is it catfishing when it’s just straight up someone else’s picture, or does it have to be your own picture doctored up / photoshopped to be considered catfishing?) by a co-worker on Bumble. I’ve been stood up for a first date at three or four times. I’ve been cancelled on an hour or two before a date at least 15 times.
The last time I had an online date, everything seemed to be going fine, we had a drink at the first bar, established that we seemingly got along, went on a walk around downtown, check out a show and then all of a sudden I’m being told about a sex kit that she purchased from a vending machine while I was in the bathroom that she wants to try out. I thought she was pretty cool before that. I wasn’t 100% sure if I was attracted to her, but I knew we at least got along on a person-to-person level. Telling me about a sex kit like that on the first date was a “eh, hard pass” for me. Women have either been fully uninterested in me; or so interested in me that I find it repulsive.
Speed dating is also, completely shit; and it’s a scam. The first time I tried speed dating, it was some website where you pick your city, your age range, and then what event you’d want to attend based on your other parameters. They take your money, and then send you an email a day before the event saying the event is cancelled because they couldn’t get enough people, but you cannot have a refund either. Then you attempt to re-schedule and it gets cancelled a second time for the same reason, then a third. Finally - you attend one of these things in person, end up getting “3 matches” emailed to you, and then you attempt to make contact and never hear from anyone ever again.
I felt like a complete horses’ ass when I attempted to do speed dating a second time 12 years later and had a very similar experience. This second time around though, I did a charge back on my credit card after the 3rd cancellation because “they couldn’t get enough people to attend.” Thanks for nothing Troy.
After soooo many bad experiences, and never having any success with what are the now conventional methods, and coming to the realization that I’m likely halfway dead now… I feel like I have a trauma response to the idea of dating at this point. I’d still like to be in a happy relationship, but even thinking about trying the methods I’ve tried in the past one more time causes me anxiety.
I’m introverted by nature, and as of 7 months ago, I live alone in a state, where I also work remotely from home and know no one. When I first got here, I tried a few events from Meetup.com thinking, “hey, maybe this is how 40-year-olds make friends,” but didn’t enjoy anything that I went to, other than the events where people sit in an audience quietly and watch someone else on stage. I found a really cool thing that I like attending where anyone is welcome to get up on stage and tell an 8 minute story about pretty much anything - fact or fiction. I really enjoy attending these, but it’s no way to meet people. The epidemic in question is absolutely not just about dating. It’s about making friends too.
I imagine I’m not alone in my experiences.
I think if a woman you like making a hard pass at you makes you want to pass on her, you have something internal to resolve if you’re thinking you still want to be in an intimate relationship with another human being.
I mean dating at 40 has to be hard anyway. Your body does not look the same. It does not work the same. And making friends when you’re older is hard. If you’re religious you can try joining the church. At the stage thing did you go up and tell a story?
I think the rejection of the hard pass was maybe me more deciding that I wasn’t attracted to her. Maybe something else though, you could be right.
Atheist (but maybe Buddhist after a lot of stuff I’ve been reading recently), so the religious thing is mostly a no go. Perhaps I’ll explore Buddhism a bit more though, and see if there’s a temple or something the sort local to me. That could be interesting.
I’ve not gotten up and told a story, no. I don’t really have one that I’d like to share yet. I just enjoy listening to other peoples’ stories for the most part. There’s also the aspect of not necessarily knowing if it’s fact or fiction sometimes that adds some excitement.
For me personally, it’s a combination of factors. A non zero number of my exes lost interest after a while and it damaged my ego pretty badly. Dating Apps are a string of getting ghosted with the occasional date that leads to me paying for drinks and dinner, only to get ghosted. I’ve always been a shy person and I can only handle so much failure before I don’t want to play anymore. I missed out on the high school and college dating scenes and it shows. There is one common denominator in all of my dating failures and it’s me.
Men don’t want to be branded ‘creepy’ and women have constantly stated they want to be left alone. Men listened.
Now now. Don’t blame women.
Yeah it’s not women per se, though most guys have had bad experiences. It’s also bad economics, loss of third spaces, loss of communities, excess screens, and the shifting cultural expectations that follow from these material changes.
It is hard to create real human intimacy when you interact with people primarily through profiles and media.
So much this. Between the loss of local community and third spaces, society is taking a beating.
Are the non-ace okay?
is the joke here that this thread is fake and gay?
Did i do a 4chan correctly?
EDIT: this comment section is filled with children apparently, not sure they knew lemmy existed, but i guess that answers that question huh.
i guess they’re not getting laid and are very angry about it too. sorry about your fee fees, incels.
BRING ON THE DOWNVOTES CUCKS
People in this thread are fucking wild… In college, and before I met my wife, I’d just get fucking trashed at house parties and then try to hit on anything with a pulse. Now, I’m not some “lady’s man,” and I didn’t pull them all, but it definitely worked well enough to get me laid when I wasn’t dating someone.
Shocker - never maced or reported for sexual assault?
at house parties
Try this not at a house party.*
I’m lucky that I met my fiance after being loaned to her as a sex toy by someone I met on OKC
* What I mean here is that there aren’t many “third-spaces” as the neo-urbanists call them, where it is assumed to be appropriate to approach anyone romantically. Workplaces have HR, and contrary to Pornhub there aren’t many chances for romantic connection in your home.
My hypothesis is that having a place where people go to see and be seen is essential to the human mating process.
Well, that’s one hell of a meet-cute.
It was at a kink convention. We got a round of applause from a man in the Sex Room, and we embraced him. Then as we smoked outside an old lady said “Oh, aren’t you a cute couple” and we had to explain that we’d just met.
Survivor bias is a hell of a drug
It’s not survivor bias when others commit suicide. This isn’t arbitrary luck selecting some to have good lives, that’s just doomerism, self loathing and anexity talking.
Yeah, but you got invited to parties in the first place.
Quit your doomin’. This isn’t complicated. Parties aren’t like they are in movies, it’s literally just getting drunk on a couch. Don’t let the social anexity win. Just invite everyone you know to yours and tell them to invite who they know. As long as you meet someone new then your circle is growing. Friends of friends exist.
I literally had one friend like 7 years ago until I moved in with a barely functional alcoholic I knew from playing magic. He was an asshole with creepy friends, but those friends were dominos that led me to a few bad relationship, and eventually my wife.
About 6-9 years ago, I made an acquaintance through events in town who created a unique meetup group. I think he was in grad school, he wasn’t from the area originally. He started a group of people meeting at a bar called The “BarNameHere” Experiment via a mailing list and just invited people and told them to bring a friend. Sometimes there was a theme or a game. Sometimes 5 people showed up sometimes 30.
Anyway, it felt like the perfect way to create your own friend circle by providing a place for people to meet new people etc. I guess you need some charisma to be that person but imagine dropping everything, moving to a new place, finding a chill bar you can get people to gather at, and literally just invite random people to bring their friends and make it happen every week. It’s an Experiment. Like can you create a friend circle out of nobody?
Other people in the thread discuss the concept of losing our “third-places”. And then some people are out there are creating third places for themselves out of thin air. Not easy to do but it’s a concept that can work like you said:
Just invite everyone you know to yours and tell them to invite who they know. As long as you meet someone new then your circle is growing.
Women don’t want to be approached in public.
Men learn this quickly.
Also that speed dating stat is totally a lie, every dating event is a sausage fest.
Most speed dating events don’t actually exist. It’s just a scam to collect money and put you on an indefinite wait list.
It’s starting to change. It’s hardly the norm but speed dating events in New York, LA have had shortages of men.
Especially with the terrible press and stories coming from them… men are starting to just not attend.
Like what? What’s gone wrong?
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Historically only men showing up
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Only desperate people showing up
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Has anything good ever come from a speed dating event? I haven’t heard of one.
They just don’t have a great reputation in general. I went to a speed friending event once and, ugh, that was not fun.
To make matters even crazier, younger generations are also just… not even trying to hook up. Some studies are showing 45% of men age 18-25 have never even approached a woman romantically.
Not succeeded, just even tried.
Dating be incredibly fucking weird right now.
I fully understand and respect people just giving up on dating, it’s exhausting and demoralising. I also think a lot of women have unrealistic expectations of what dating will be like.
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In high school, I tried to start dating a girl by asking for her Facebook account, but she rejected me. Something that women don’t understand is that constantly doing that is demoralizing. But I think that’s part of beign a male.
Women don’t want to be approached in public.
Bro, so how are we supposed to meet each other? Telepathy?
I assume the ones who say that will initiate their own relationships when they are ready.
Clearly enough women are saying this that it’s having an effect.
Like in the olden days. You raid a village with the boys and rape.
Obviously joking, though keep in mind that warfare and the subsequent rapes was usually how nations kept populations up. Plus, families have more children the poorer and more devastated an area is for some reason. So…good news! We will all have a goth GF in post-apocalyptic America.
This is absolute made up nonsense, and yet it tells us so much about what kind of content you consume and what kind of attitude you have.
Obviously joking… Haha… Unless…
Women don’t want to be approached in public.
I think the problem is that men don’t want to be approached in public. Or in private, for that matter. Half the joke of this is how antisocial, short-tempered, and easily discouraged men are.
We have a tendency to assume other people think like us, so that would actually explain a lot.
I just don’t think people want men around.
im pretty sure people do.
Last i checked they were pretty important.
That is not the impression I get anymore to be honest.
45% of men 18 to 25 have never asked out a woman in person
I can’t speak for the whole 45% but some of us have heard stories from women about how that other 55% can behave. I think I’d rather wait for a lady to (never) ask me out then put someone in the position of thinking “Oh, is he gonna take it bad if I say no?”
This is it. I feel like I am inflicting myself on women. That I am a problem for them simply for existing. Why would I do something like that to someone if its as bad as we are always being told?
Bachelor pride vibes.
You’ve drank too much ideological koolaid. People aren’t what you read in the news or a great deal of the internet.
It’s actually really easy to get a date in person if you are not a total ogre and treat women like normal people.
Weirdo white knights can easily end up as incels. Neither of those groups tend to do very well in actual social situations.
Get out and ask some people. Plenty of women like it as long as you’re polite
Until you approach another wrong one and you get another lecture for saying hi
This shit is actually happening
So walk away from them, or handle it gracefully somehow. It’s the same as trying to make a friend. Doesn’t everyone make friends from time to time?
Interest + effort = relationship of any kind. Find the shared interest, make a little bit of effort… or don’t and the math doesn’t work. If romance doesn’t come, you’ve made a friend.
Enough negative experiences reinforce and define behavior.
This is true for any being with a nervous system.
IDK why you think every individual magically changing is something realistic.
it’s just that you’re fragile and a disgrace. it’s revolting. the fascists are taking over. grow some confidence. we need heroes, not insecure little boys. you know what will get you laid real quick? bashin the fash.
Yes, fragility is disgracefvll veakness. To defeat the enemy ze men mvst be strong, zey mvst be heroes, zey must have vill to seize vhat zey vant. It vill to pover zat vill tvrn little boys into strong men. Zis is antifascism.
“Polite” implies that if you’re agreeable and friendly women will understand that you’re interested in them and not just being agreeable and friendly.
I think part of the problem is that what we’re all really after is fucking, which isn’t polite at all. Being polite about it just makes you look weak and ineffective at the thing that we all say we want but can’t mention.
If any mention of sex by a man is considered inappropriate, how is a man supposed to negotiate sex?
This is a big reason why I’m engaged: We got the impolite part out of the way first.
So many comments echoing “women told us to stop approaching us, so we did!”
I mean no offense, truly, but you missed the point if that’s the message you took. It wasn’t “Do not, under any circumstances, speak to a woman” it was, “if you shoot your shot and she’s not interested, move on and don’t make it weird. If she is at work, be very careful as customer service does not equal flirting.” Yes, there are some grey areas (not sure even the best gentleman could slide up to a woman alone in a parking lot and not freak her out), but some of you are kicking up the board without even moving a piece. Stop pushing the narrative that only attractive men can speak to women. Not only are you assuming you’re not attractive by saying that (which cannot be good for your confidence) , you’re reducing women’s feelings and concerns as being blindly shallow and unwarranted.
The world is not full of only beautiful people, yet people still live and love. Not to dismiss the difficulties (as an uggo myself, I get it), but you can get out there, I know you can.
Why does it have to be men doing the asking? Maybe it’s the 'tism talking but I tend to be very onboard for the whole equity and equality stuff especially in a relationship. I have never understood why people feel so strongly about gendered roles or activities. Despite being functional in pretty much all traditionally gendered skills (in both directions), I haven’t really ever encountered someone that takes it as seriously.
Of the women I have dated that have been the most vocal about equity and DEI when I point out that they tend to all back to traditional gender roles when it’s to their advantage they have all essentially ended up saying that it is just their personal preference. Well no shit. I’m sure there are plenty of men who would prefer to be able to have all of the housework done by their partner, or billionaires that don’t want to give up any of their money even if they talk about wealth inequality. Just because it’s a preference doesn’t mean it’s OK.
Men don’t have to be the ones asking, but I was responding to the idea that men can’t approach women by default. Either gender can shoot their shot.
And those women can have a preference for a more “traditional” role, it just means they need to be aware that not every guy they meet is going to be cool with that and that may mean making a choice down the line. The idea is that two people are in a relationship that works for them and everyone is safe and respected. So, yes, it’s okay for people to have that preference. The issue is forcing your preference to be the standard.
The issue with the women I have met in my example is that they only want the advantages of the traditional without the negatives. They want the emotional and labor and physical chores to be shared equally, but they don’t want to be responsible for initiating or pursuing. Nor do they have any interest in learning how to do basic things with tools and would rather their partner deal with it.
If we aren’t going to give a misogynist a pass because they don’t want to give up what they have for equality because that’s just his preference, then I don’t think it’s fair to give anyone else a pass when applying the same logic.
fuck em. let em figure it out. this is no time for weakness.
I don’t know man, it sounds like you follow rule 1 and 2 and don’t realize it.
18-25 in 2025 means 13-20 when COVID happened.
We’re going to see the long term effects of people in that micro generation losing much of what the high school social scene represented, that low stakes junior league of forming new relationships, where meeting is easy, with lots of natural opportunities for free interaction, and making new connections is normal. Learning to flirt in that environment is a stepping stone towards being able to navigate the adult world, where people don’t have your schedule planned out for you, and you won’t naturally see the same people 100+ days out of the year, and have 50+ chances to shoot your shot when you’re ready.
And yes, sure, the loss of third places and changing social dynamics and gender roles and the economy play a role, too, for pretty much everyone under 40. But it’s worth pointing out that this specific age cohort has special challenges on top of the issues that everyone else is living, too.
there also could end up being echos of the disturbance for years to come as the traditions that would have been spread by upperclassmen died out.
I’ve tried and I’m still trying. As someone who is a bit shorter than average and is socially awkward, it’s tough. Recently I’ve been able to get dates with 3 girls from dating apps (due to me being better at flirting and getting a few more matches than before), but they all went nowhere.
1 girl didn’t seem to want any touching or flirty things on the first date and the conversation wasn’t smooth, so I friendzoned her.
The other 2 girls immediately started with a flirty text conversation.
I hit it off with first one over text, we were having long phone calls and sending raunchy stuff over text. I had one short date with and was planning a spicier 2nd date with but she cancelled because I asked her to be my Valentine on Valentine’s Day.
The 2nd one wanted to take things slower, and friendzoned me after 2 longer dates. She also wasn’t that into touching.
I never kissed any of these girls. I don’t know what I’m doing wrong, especially with the first flirty girl.
it’s a dating app. Nobody wants anything from them.
Not doing anything wrong homie in fact youre doing it perfect. Just keep trying like you said, cuz it’s nothing personal, you either vibe or you don’t. Keep being natural so when you do click with someone they’re connecting with the real you
It’s a complicated issue with a lot of layers. Like a depressing onion.
Men were told to stop approaching women for any reason in any situation. So we did.
Dating apps and websites have overinflated women’s egos and absolutely obliterated most mens egos. The average looking guy with a job and some normal hobbies is going to get very few matches where as most women get hundreds a day regardless of their level of employment or having hobbies. This leads to women believing they can find the millionaire bachelor if they just hold out for longer when in reality they are not the women that the millionaire bachelor is going to pick.
Most women still expect men to be chivalrous and pay on the first date, but they have no actual intention of pursuing a relationship with that guy. Unfortunately some women have learned they can get a free meal and entertainment for an evening at no cost if they just say yes to dates they have no interest in. Most guys have been burned by that as some point.
A lot of women are still playing games. Saying no because they want the man to “chase” them or “fight” for them. Most guys have stopped entertaining that behavior whatsoever but I still see so many women doing it. As men we can’t tell if that’s what you want or if you actually mean it when you say no so the majority of us will immediately stop pursuing you if you decline us. I’m 33 and women are STILL doing this. I thought it would taper off as I got farther from high school aged girls but from my experience it has not gone down in any significant way.
There are a million other reasons and nuanced details but I am tired of typing.
Myself and most men I know around my age who all did very well in the dating scene when we were younger have just completely given up on dating now. We have zero interest in putting in the time, energy and money into something that yeilds nothing in return these days.
Like most things I think this will reach a breaking point and things will shift but I’m not sure when that will be or what will push things over the edge.
Summary: hoe_math
Right?
His videos are hilarious. Mostly accurate too.
Same here. Most women bring nothing to the table, so there’s no rush. I’d rather save the money and spend my time studying or playing video games
I definitely wouldn’t say they bring nothing to the table. It’s just that they expect you to bring a lot to the table and often times they bring little to the table. If they also didn’t expect you to bring much then it wouldn’t be so bad, but they expect it all while doing little to nothing in return.
If you don’t like women, then date men. You are telling us you can’t connect to women, then you aren’t attracted to them. If you were you would connect emotionally with them. You’re probably just straight because you were told to be for so long and you made it an identity. Open your mind and think about those male friends you had you made excuses to wrestle with a little bit more just so you could feel his touch. Just give in to what you know to be true.
This is stupid and you should feel bad.
Listen if I was gay I would date a man so quickly. Unfortunately I just do not find men sexually attractive. Trust me.
You’re being creepy.
I do like women and I do maintain platonic relationships with women
My aunt admitted she did the free meal thing back in the 70s. It’s not new. This whole thing is bs. People just have whiny echo chambers now.
I never said it was a new shitty behavior from women. It’s just that more men are aware of it now. Especially since a lot of women will post about it online and while they do get to share it with their yaaas queen slay fan base men do also see those posts. They see those comments where women are bragging about how many dates they have gone on with zero intention of actually romantically engaging with the man at any point.
And to be clear I am not sitting here thinking this is a one way street. I am fully aware that men have a long history of going on dates just to get laid and then never talking to that woman again.
Both genders got shit they need to work on just like most people got shit they need to work on.
I think you’re still just seeing the noisy few and those people are not the norm. The most vocal people are not necessarily the majority. I think most people on both sides or all sides are just looking for someone they’re compatible with
So either myself and all other other single men I talk to about this all have terrible luck or there is some sort of shift that’s happened in the last ~10 years and it’s finally getting so bad that others are picking up on it.
I was in a relationship or dating in one form or another from the age of like 14 until I was ~27. Only in the last 6-7 years did it get really bad.
I think it’s a combination of a lot of things but ultimately it’s become a numbers game and most guys just don’t want to put up with the bullshit anymore. Especially in this economy many dudes are just checking out. Not only from dating but basically everything.
You’re complaints sound like they were copy and pasted from an Andrew Tate manuscript. Most men I know who are healthy and well adjusted have a girlfriend or wife. I dont think ive dated a woman in the last 5 years who expected me to be chivalrous or wanted to “play games” with me and make me chase. My friends and I have been having amazing luck with dating recently I guess. 8 out of 9 of us are either married or in a long term relationship. And were not rich or extremely attractive lmfao. Maybe it’s because none of us are incels and don’t just wanna fuck the first thing with 2 legs to say yes. I feel like men like you can’t see anything a woman is past the vagina, like maybe if you tried to just be friendly instead of horny they would’ve opened up to you and trusted you. Instead most men act like women owe them something when they buy them a gift or a meal. My friends have paid for my food before and I didn’t get on the ground and suck them off, why should a girl be expected to do that.
First of all: *Your
Secondly: Yikes bro. You made a LOT of assumptions and pretty much all of them were wrong.
I don’t really give a shit about sex. At least that’s not my goal when dating. I am looking for someone that is kind, thoughtful and curious. Someone who is intellectually stimulating and emotionally mature.
I could call up pretty much any of my exes and get sex if that’s all I was after. I am just looking for genuine human connection.
When my choices are expend time, energy and money just to be taken advantage of/toyed with or sit at home and be at peace with myself I’m gonna take the peace every time now.
If you went fishing for years and never caught anything except toxic sludge at some point you just stop fishing. Spend that time and energy on something else. That’s where most men are at these days. And yeah some of those guys are just unrealistic assholes, but most of them really aren’t.
Personally I am just living my life. If I happen to bump into someone and hit it off I won’t fight it, but I’m not going to actively spend my time, money and energy looking anymore.
What stinks like shit? Oh it’s your personality.
Interesting response. I take it you must be one of those women I was referring to in part of my comment somewhere.
Says an asshat
